The reality of black Africa in Britain
long discussion thread on “The reality of black Africa,”
Karen had written: “The basic assumption that all humans are alike and want the same things is wrong. … That is why when Africans live in the West, they create African type of areas.” A reader took strong exception
to that, saying that “People are infinitely more similar than they are different,” and that Africans are changed and improved by being brought to live in the West.
But look at this headline and lead in the Times of London:
‘Witch child’ abuse spreads in Britain
50 cases suspected in London alone
AN official inquiry into the abuse of African children branded as witches is expected to conclude that there have been at least 50 such cases over five years in London alone.
Clearly, the simple act of importing Africans en masse into the West does not Westernize Africans, certainly not all Africans; it Africanizes the West
. Western countries now find themselves having to deal with such practices as female genital mutilation, the horrible abuse of children because they’re believed to be witches, and many other alien horrors never seen or remotely imagined in the West before, and all this is happening for one reason and one reason only: the modern Western belief that “people are infinitely more similar than they are different.”
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I’m very impressed with poster Karen. In many ways, she is the closest among your readers to my position. She cuts to the most fundamental understanding of the differences among groups, in particular blacks v. other races.
She understands the importance of sensibility, as well as intelligence, in describing the differences among groups. Apartheid was a flawed attempt by white South Africans to separate the races. However, what was needed was a complete separation into totally different countries. White South Africans didn’t have the stomach to do this and the world was against them. By combining the groups into one entity, South Africa is now on the path to destruction. In addition, whites themselves have greatly added to this problem by enabling blacks to multiply radically without forcibly imposing any standards or restraints on blacks.
This points to the truism that contact between unequals is always bad, whether in Africa, Europe or the United States.
Thanks. At least someone can see sense.
The reader who took exception and believes that all Africans want to come to the West is wrong. The wealthy ones certainly don’t want to live in the USA or have a USA passport as they would have to pay taxes and servants/chauffeurs are too expensive. The professional African middle classes don’t drive their own cars, clean their own homes or cook their own meals, they have servants (house boys) and they cannot have these in the West. Africans who come to the West are largely the criminal classes (professional or non professional) and the unskilled/low skilled or professional people who cannot get good jobs in Africa. Africans are lazy and like to live in big villas with a dozen servants. Western civilization is not of interest to them. An African’s status is decided by the size of his house and the number of servants he has and the number of cars and not by his interest in operas, ballets, concerts or art galleries. And no one ever asks where the money came from.
The poorer Africans tolerate the West rather then like it because it is easier to work for Western people than their own people who often abuse them. That does not mean that they like the West or want to be Western. And Africans deteriorate when they come to the West. Their behavior is much worse than in their own countries where they are to some extent constrained by the tribe and extended family. Their differences from whites and other races become apparent to them whereas in Africa they are more content. In the West Africans dislike whites and Asians almost equally.
Regarding the witches and child killing, it is common in Africa and adults too are sacrificed. Most of the people doing this are “Christians” and they also believe in witchcraft and black magic (kindoki or juju). The Nigerian diplomats are thought to be involved in the trafficking of children from Africa to Europe explicitly for the purpose of child sacrifice. The children are kidnapped in villages and taken to Europe with fake documents stating that they are the child of nephew/niece of someone. Hence African governments are involved in this. In London 300 African children are missing from school, their whereabouts not known. In Nigeria many children and adults are missing but that is common and the police don’t do much. In allowing Africans to live in the West, we have brought these traditions here and we will not get rid of them until Africans are removed from the West because they cannot be changed. It is not just the uneducated who are doing this, it is an organized and profitable business.
Some brief points in response to recent Larry’s, Karen’s and readers’ comments on blacks:
1) Many Western Muslims may be said to have different aspirations due to their religion and culture. The same does not hold true for blacks. In many ways they have very similar aspirations to ours, for good or bad: material wealth, having lots of fun, having lots of sex, dominating in sports and music, wanting to be part of the political process, wanting to practice their religion in peace, etc. I see a lot of similarity! Of course it depends which part of the white indigenous culture you are talking about, it is extremely divided in its aspirations on certain levels. White neo-hippies and very “straight” white mid-Western Christians and white heavy metal freaks all may very different aspirations even if they are all white. One has to be aware of these vast differences within the white culture when talking about white aspirations. And it depends on which part of the black culture you are talking about. The black family which I know wouldn’t go to a party if I paid them. They are very “spiritual.” They are not promiscuous at all. They want success for their children. They want to be safe from violence. Whether they would have been like that in Africa, I have no idea, but they are full Westerners now. Other blacks would have different aspirations and behaviour patterns. By the way does Karen know any black people personally, if so, I’d be interested if she regards them as savages or other than human. That doesn’t mean there are no differences at all between cultures and races.
2) I disagree with your inference (“Jeff-style solicitude” I think it was) that I was very liberal on the black issue while Karen wasn’t. Is it liberal to talk about other cultures in a civil and decent way when you criticise them. Is it liberal to try and see the whole picture and not make wild generalisations about blacks. Stop trying to paint me in a liberal box so you feel you’ve “won the arguement.”
3) I doubt Karen’s view that most Africans are very happy is true. Modern Africa is a s**thole and I imagine most blacks would prefer to be elsewhere.
4)The idea that Western blacks don’t like white Westerners, if I understood Karen’s view correctly, (she may be talking about American blacks only) is simply false, at least here in the UK… African blacks are extremely friendly (more than most immigrant groups) and respectful to UK whites, I can attest to that personally. If she meant Westernised blacks, there is antagonism towards whites from some UK blacks, certainly more than from Africans, but on the whole black-white relations have never been better. Many intermarriages are going on as well. There is far more antagonism from young Muslims.
5) Larry, surely the reader/commenter who talked about blacks changing in the West didn’t mean that America or the West was obligated to take in all blacks. You’re putting words in his mouth. And before you put words in my mouth, I am still for zero immigration from black Africans to here (UK). I have said previously that I am critical of many parts of black culture and I have not changed my mind. But even if all black culture was a positive addition to indigenous white culture, I would oppose any further immigration. White Western indigenous UK culture is being swamped and immigration to it must completely stop (including from Eastern European whites).
Jeff is putting words in my mouth. I did not say that the reader had said that the West was “obligated” to take in all blacks. I did however correctly spell out the meaning of the reader’s argument, which is that in order to demonstrate the essential sameness of all humans that he believes in, black Africans must be brought to the West, because only in the West will they be exposed to Western culture and see its desirability and assimilate themselves to it. The reader made that point over and over; I was not putting words in his mouth.
How can Jeff “have seen the whole picture” when he has never been to Africa, describes it as a “s***hole” and knows about 4 black people? He lives in a fantasy world like the liberal he is (his aspirations are quite liberal). He extrapolates his knowledge of one pious black family to the whole black race. As for Africa being the way he describes it, he cannot understand how Africans can be happy there. That is the same error liberals make. Some people in Africa live very well and many are very happy. The countries are dysfunctional but that does not make them miserable.
Jeff wants an end to all black and Muslim immigration. But he doesn’t like it when he feels that people are wholesale denying the good qualities of a different people or of all individuals in that people.
Jeff writes [This e-mail came before I posted Karen’s above e-mail]:
Karen’s generalisations are way too broad combined with her totally one-sided view of things, combined with an uncivil attitude towards blacks. I deal with blacks all the time and did so in America too. While some of them fit the picture she paints in part, a huge amount don’t. Like Sailor, she is far too obsessed with certain aspects of blacks so she misses the bigger picture. Again that doesn’t mean I don’t see severe flaws in black culture.
As for the recolonisation discussion, I find a contradiction when you say we should stay out of Middle East Muslim affairs (unless they attack us) yet intervene (you do say not directly) in African affairs. And of course, recolonisation (which you apparently don’t support) is not worth discussing, like your suggestion of removal of immigrant groups wasn’t. They both have zero chance of happening so I am not interested. Nothing to do with “defeatism.” Stopping African and Muslim immigration to the West is what we should be concentrating on. And thinking how to discourage the high birthrate of both groups. And thinking how to relate seriously to the immigrant groups that have settled here as they ain’t going nowhere. And planning to deal with the big picture from a minority point of view, because demographically speaking that is what we will probably be by the end of the century. Try to stop it by all means but plan ahead for its reality as well..
I just watched Germany beat Argentina and the German coach planned ahead in the game to a far greater extent than the Argentinian coach (who took off his best offensive player in the hope of defending a 1-0 lead, then when it was 1-1 he didn’t have the use of that player anymore). practical strategy and tactics are what’s needed if we’re going to deal with immigration problems. Not these ridiculous over the top generalised dumbed down attacks on and generalisations of blacks (or even Muslims) which may make some people feel good but are a real distraction.
Needless to say I disagree with Jeff on several points and I think he is being defeatist. I will try to reply in detail in the next few days.
Karen’s depiction of the facts about Nigeria was priceless. It should be read by every politician because it is the exactly the same in the Mideast, if not worse.
Posted by Lawrence Auster at June 29, 2006 10:04 AM | Send
Thank God for the politically incorrect and independent bloggers like yourself. I see that TV cable news commentators—the talking heads who mostly have no thoughts of their own but still must fill an hour program each day—are increasingly turning to bloggers to skim their points. They then reduce the arguments to a digestible two or three sentences and start barking. Nevertheless, they are doing their part in spreading bloggers’ ideas to a mass audience. Encouraging.